Jobcentre discrimination

Discussions relating to jobs and working, including finding work, interviews, the work place etc.

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jimmy87notts
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Jobcentre discrimination

Post by jimmy87notts »

I was at the jobcentre today for a routine appointment, I told the woman who was dealing asked me if i have any disabilities and i said yes i do, Dyspraxia. She said it is not a disability....! I told her yes it is, and she just would not believe me. She then proceded to tell me, cant i just get over it :Eek: . When i finished my appointment i left there feeling worthless, humiliated and hurt, very very hurt. Ive had to leave 2 if not 3 jobs because they told me to " get over it or dont bother comming back" I have had this in every situation imaginable, im not believed and im treated like im stupid. I dont know how much more of this i can take. Apart from lodging a formal complaint can anybody give me any other advice. Im desperate.
Tom fod
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Tom fod »

First of all welcome to the Group and I'm really depressed to read about your experience at your jobcentre

It was definitely mentioned in the Disability Discrimination Act 1995. Not sure about specific mention in New Equality Act 2010 but my understanding is it is counted as a disability because the document "Guidance on matters to be taken into account in determining questions relating to the definition of disability" still applies unless they've finally got round to writing an updated version which was expected Spring 2011.

The definition of ‘disability’ under the Equality Act 2010

In the Act, a person has a disability if:
* they have a physical or mental impairment
* the impairment has a substantial and long-term adverse effect on their ability to perform normal day-to-day activities

For the purposes of the Act, these words have the following meanings:
* 'substantial' means more than minor or trivial
* 'long-term' means that the effect of the impairment has lasted or is likely to last for at least twelve months (there are special rules covering recurring or fluctuating conditions)
* 'normal day-to-day activities' include everyday things like eating, washing, walking and going shopping

People who have had a disability in the past that meets this definition are also protected by the Act.
Progressive conditions considered to be a disability

There are additional provisions relating to people with progressive conditions. People with HIV, cancer or multiple sclerosis are protected by the Act from the point of diagnosis. People with some visual impairments are automatically deemed to be disabled.

Conditions that are specifically excluded
Some conditions are specifically excluded from being covered by the disability definition, such as a tendency to set fires or addictions to non–prescribed substances.


No mention of Dyspraxia in that last part.

You could make an official complaint but civil servants seem to be treated like scum by the government too and they probably don't have enough manpower to follow it up and learn from any complaint

if you feel strongly it is worth a go if you have the energy.

Where are you from in the UK. Have you tried looking to any other organisations for help in finding work and what type of job are you looking for/have you tried?

Must admit I really felt sick and had cause to swear at the telly when Cameron started going on about his late son and 'seeing the boy not the wheelchair' at the Tory Party conference last week. Satirical website www.newsthump.com had an interesting alternative to the story.
Tom
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With a foot full of bullets I tried to run faster but I just hobbled on to the next disaster.
(from Peter and the Test Tube Babies, Foot Full of Bullets)
shadowgirl021
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by shadowgirl021 »

I was going to ask what kind of jobs are you looking for as well until I realised that was already asked because more sectors are more tolerable. I have had struggles with jobs and management as well getting sacked but trust me there are good jobs out their and managers. That reaction is really bad, it does normally come from people who don't understand what Dyspraxia is, my mum said that to me when I first told her someone said to me "This is what you have"

Being from Nottingham myself, I find this upsetting especially since I havent received any really harsh negative comments and you obviously have. If you are with the job centre for nine months you can get transferred to a company called Ingeus who are really helpful or remploy. Since you have more experience, next time you get a job just explain your difficulties and what you can do. If your manager is a good one they should allow an open door policy. It will get easier with employment, trust me :)

I dont know what to suggest about the job centre, I would say that was just one stupid jobcentre person who shouldnt be allowed to advise people of all abilities how to get a job. You could ask to be seen by someone else?
jimmy87notts
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by jimmy87notts »

Im applying for bar/waiter and retail jobs. I know bar and waitering is difficult with dyspraxia but its all i know. The 2 jobs were both in hospitlity. One at Premier Inn and the other one was Pumpkin ( on the railway stations) Pumpkin religated me to cleaning duties only before i walked out. I wasnt even allowed near the tills or coffee machines.

It doesnt matter where i work, managers just cannot get it into there heads what it is, they call me lazy and find cuse to get rid

What i want to do is work in a bridal store, but its difficult getting into that anyway and even more difficult being a man.

I have lodged a formal complaint against the jobcentre and they are sending forms out to me to fill out and send back, but i somehow dont feel like it would be enough.
shadowgirl021
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by shadowgirl021 »

My friend has Dyspraxia and she used to work in a bar and I know that several people here have said on here they work in cafes and restaurants, they found it hard but I am sure they said that had good/understanding managers or found a suitable way to cope. If you want to work in a bridal shop could you volunteer? or start looking solely for retail work which might be easy with Christmas coming up. It doesnt just have to fashion shops. I was looking for books on Dyspraxia in Waterstones and the shop assistant who helped me find one said she had it too.

I would have expected more from Premier inn :S and I have been to pumpkin on the, well near train station, always seemed so nice and friendly. I am sorry you were treated like this.
Captain_Ludd
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Captain_Ludd »

Hi Jimmy,

That kind of treatment is absolutely awful being told its not a disability is bad enough but be told in that manor by someone who is meant to be supporting you is just plain disgraceful.

Dyspraxia is recognised neurological impairment if that stupid women says anything next time tell her she’s talking out her arse.

Dyspraxia is a legally registered disability under the Disability Discrimination Act (DDA) 1995, the Chronically Sick & Disabled Persons Act 1970 and the education act 1993.

Under the DDA she has broken the law simply by discriminating against you while attempting to apply for jobs !!

People like her drive me mad they make huge negative sweeping assumptions about people they know nothing about with conditions they either don’t care about or are to pig ignorant to understand grrr .... :@ :evil: .
Sorry about the rant.
AlleyCat
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by AlleyCat »

People like her drive me mad they make huge negative sweeping assumptions about people they know nothing about with conditions they either don’t care about or are to pig ignorant to understand grrr ....
I agree completely, Captain Ludd. Unfortunately there still seems to be a huge amount of ignorance out there about what dyspraxia is and the impact it has on people who have it. I've had a multitude of problems due to the ignorance of others, whether I've disclosed or not. One of the worst experiences is probably with the SENCO of a secondary school at which I was employed as a teaching assistant, who went on to criticise me for 'speaking too loudly' and 'interrupting' despite having taken me on in full knowledge of my dyspraxia. To me, it seemed as if she had perhaps been keen to employ me to 'tick the equal opportunities box' but had no intention of making allowances for me having the condition- it's quite possible that she didn't know much about it, but I feel she should have taken it upon herself to find out more, especially given that she was the SENCO.


Jimmy87- your experience is very frustrating. It's bad enough that you've been faced with ignorant employers, but to have encountered a Job Centre 'adviser' with a similar attitude to them is infuriating. How dare she tell you to 'get over it!' I wonder if she would say the same to someone with cerebral palsy?! As everyone who posts on here knows all too well, dyspraxia is a neurological condition which we did not choose to have. If we could just 'snap out of it' or stop ourselves from doing various things or coming across in various ways which other people object to, don't they think we would have done it by now?! No child chooses to do things or appear in a way which makes him or her a target for bullies, but most of us on here have been bullied as children for things we couldn't control. During my time at secondary school, I was subjected to vicious bullying because of the way I speak (which is as a direct result of having dyspraxia)- it has devastated me to have employers and even course tutors criticise me for 'not being able to communicate effectively'- this inevitably refers to the way I speak (speed, articulation and volume), rather than the content of my speech. It exasperates me that ignorant employers and course tutors seem to think that I am deliberately choosing to speak in a way which has made me a target for bullying and which has had a detrimental impact on my career prospects. Anyhow, you might find this guide helpful, if you can get someone from the Job Centre to look at it. It's very comprehensive about the range of issues which people with dyspraxia can present with in the workplace, as well as the strengths they may bring:

http://www.dyspraxiafoundation.org.uk/d ... ia_1.0.pdf

You might also want to consider writing to your MP, as this is something which Peter Keegan was encouraging people to do fairly recently on the Dyspraxia Foundation National Adult Support Group's page on Facebook. He produced a template letter for others to use, although you might want to produce one of your own, especially as I think it's particularly important to highlight the poor service you have received from the Job Centre. You can find your local MP here:

http://findyourmp.parliament.uk/

Don't give up on your ambition of working in a bridal shop. I actually think that working in a specialist area of retail, such as bridalwear, could be more suitable for someone with dyspraxia than working in a supermarket or busy chain store. I would have thought that working in a bridal shop would give you more scope for making use of typical dyspraxic strengths such as creativity, as well as possibly being less stressful due to having more time available to spend with individual customers.
jimmy87notts
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by jimmy87notts »

If i dont feel like my complaint has been delt with satisfactorily where else can i go to to get advice. Im just sick of being made to feel stupid and treated like a piece of **** whos not worth peoples time, consideration or energy
AlleyCat
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by AlleyCat »

I'm also sick of being treated like crap and looked down on in employment, as well as on courses. The way you've been treated by the Job Centre is definitely not on- I've just been trying to find out where you could go to complain about them, and discovered this site:

http://www.ombudsman.org.uk

It's supposed to be responsible for handling complaints about the way a range of government bodies operate, including the Job Centre (I was just reading a case study about a man who complained to the Ombudsman about them). It would definitely be worth putting in a complaint to them if you get no joy out of the Job Centre. It makes me so angry that you've come across the same kind of attitude from one of their 'advisers' (who is supposedly there to help you), as the ignorant employers who have prevented you from earning a living. The way you have been treated by the Job Centre just takes the pi&$ !
jimmy87notts
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by jimmy87notts »

Thank you everybody, i cant begin to tell you how humbling it is to find people who know what its like and care enough to help. Maybe the human race isn't so harsh after-all :bumps:
ALADDIN
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by ALADDIN »

The jobcentre is a total waste of time. I visited the Disability Employment Advisor, she knew nothing about dyspraxia, she directed me to the local Dyspraxia support group who were rude to me, The lady who ran the Dyspraxia support group, has a "double personality", when she is with other adult dyspraxics, she is pleasant to me but when she denies entry to me to the pub group and says that she cannot help me, recommending the Disability Employment Advisor. She said take your mother (who is very ill) to get support from the Disability Employment Advisor. There are a few problems, I am not a child, I have only recently been privately diagnosed with dyspraxia, having had a childhood knowledge of dyspraxia, 10 years thanks to no support from the N.H.S and only information on childhood dyspraxia, I am not a classic aspie ( I only have a couple of aspergers traits), some people say that I have no traits.
At least, the most recent visit to the Disability Employment Advisor, was not unpleasant.

I contacted another Disability Employment Advisor, she admitted that she did not know to help me, did not about my conditions, but she had helped other dyspraxics, probably not graduates.

In 2005, I tried to get onto a course, when I thought my problems were aspergers traits and I had a weak understanding aspergers.
I tried to get onto a course thinking the National Autistic Society. I could not participate because of a lack of funding, they could not support a dyspraxic graduate who only has traits of aspergers, and lives too far from London to do a low paid, skilled job. The Disability Employment Advisor was useless or inaccurate and rude. I was redirected to RBLI, who were manipulative, rude, ignorant, arrogant and not suited to graduates.

The National Autistic Society seems to copy the Government. The only organisations that are good include DANDA and Key4Learning.

Society is completely ignorant about dyspraxia, there is still ignorance about aspergers (the Home Secretary described aspergers as an illness).
Tim G
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Tim G »

The Job Center is a compleate waste of time and has been anoying and patronising everyone dyspraxic or not. When I have been looking for work I have had bad experance with the job center allthough they werent compleatly dissmisive about dyspraxicia the problem was that they or me (most lickly) mesed up when I was due to sine on. When I went there to sine on and for my interview I was told that the person I was ment to see wasent there and that i got told that i was off the dole as i hadent sined on so had to re-apply again #-o i dont get what they couldent just say your apoitment is tommrow or the next day and if you dont come you wont get your benerfits raver then just leaving it all up to us.

There is a dysablitie adviser at the job center but I doubt if they are going to know much if any about dyspraxicia but it may help in some regards.

Complaining is a good idea as it gets your point across and somthing may be done about it.

As Allidin said socity is compleatly ignorant and not knowing of dyspraxicia and most ND issues as a whole so we do have to make oure disablities known as best we can in the given situation and educate people about dyspraxicia.

Also as Allidin pointed out, organisations like DANDA and Key for learning are verry good at what they do so all hope is not lost.
The real Mr Potato Head
Moot
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Moot »

I'm so annoyed and upset for you! Bloody Job Centre! ](*,) Definitely complain! My mum made me go there the other day to look up jobs and ended up enquiring about signing on again (despite saying she wouldn't and knowing full well I do not want to) and then embarrassing me in front of one of the staff member (won't go into details)... omg.

So I take it from this thread that dyspraxia is actually included under the acts and so if a form asks 'do you have a disability as listed under...' we can actually tick yes? And even if we might not always obviously seem to have anything wrong? I just assumed if was for disabled people who'd be in wheelchairs, etc. Or I'm just getting confused between acts? I'd still be wary of ticking it in case they then think I'm lying, ignore it (from ignorance) or lessens my chances or something.
Hopefully not making too many moot points... heh... *ahem* :D
Captain_Ludd
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Captain_Ludd »

Moo wrote: I take it from this thread that dyspraxia is actually included under the acts and so if a form asks 'do you have a disability as listed under...' we can actually tick yes? And even if we might not always obviously seem to have anything wrong? I just assumed if was for disabled people who'd be in wheelchairs, etc. Or I'm just getting confused between acts?
I haven’t signed for years so I don’t know exact details but if it says do you have a disability under the Chronically Sick & Disabled Persons Act 1970 or the education act 1993 then if you have a diagnosis of dyspraxia then put it down your not lying.

I always put down that I have dyspraxia anyhow because if you've stated it up front it cant be used against you at a later point "Oh well you didn’t tell us this before" sort of thing.

Just because you’re not in a wheel chair does not mean you don’t have a valid disability, it’s a common misconception of people with Dyspraxia/Dyslexia and other ND issues that if other people can’t see it doesn’t count hence why Dyspraxia is often referred to as a "hidden disability".
You have a registered disability and it could affect you in your work place so let them know.

With regards to the potential discrimination, if you do say something you can’t guarantee that it won’t happen.
Having said this if you don’t and you get a job in my personal experience I have found that these things have a habit of coming back to bite you later which is often worse than not getting the job in the first place.

IMHO as with most things in life honesty is the best policy.
Moot
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Re: Jobcentre discrimination

Post by Moot »

Thanks for the info there. :)
Hopefully not making too many moot points... heh... *ahem* :D
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