[survey] Link between Autism, Learning Disorders and Autism.

[dyspraxicgirl]

When I was seeking a diagnosis, I have notices that many Dyspraxia characteristics are similar to other disorders characteristics, most specifically : Autism.

From what I have read, Dyspraxia has high rates of comorbidity (mostly Dyslexia and ADHD) but usually do not include Autistic characteristics such as Repetitive Behaviours, Social Impairment (arguable) and Obessive Behaviours or narrow interests. Yet, some websites put these characteristics on their liste. Other claim that Dyspraxia is another name for Non Verbal learning Disorder or that most dyspraxics have NVLD instead of Dyspraxia (but apparently, NVLD is not considered as a real disorder everywhere).


According to my doctor, my mild dyslexia and dyscalculia are just a consequence of my spatial difficulties and are quite common among dyspraxic people but do not mean that I have the three conditions.

ADHD seems to be common too but not always diagnosed because it can be considered as a symptom of dyspraxia according to some specialists.

I have read many parents describing their dyspraxic children and while some of them only show the obvious characteristics (motor skills, speech delay), other seemed very close to Autism (enough to actually being suspected of having asperger before being diagnosed as dyspraxic).


Therefore, I was wondering what was the link between Autism and Learning Disorders. Many people in my family have a learning disorder. I have two dyspraxic uncles, one of them showed autistic traits during his childhood but now appear to be normal (and no longer dyspraxic), the other only have mild dyspraxia. It made me think that people with severe dyspraxia were more likely to develop autistic traits or overlapping conditions such as dyslexia or ADHD.

However, I have no proof of that theory.

Which is why I would be grateful if some of you were to answer to this survey.<- The first part is about your diagnosis and the other conditions you may have because I thought that it would be useless to prevent anyone with another condition to reply.

No email adress or name are asked in this survey, it's totally anonymous.

Please, note that English is not my native language so if there is something you do not understand, tell me.

Thank you.

EDIT : There was something about making eye contact in the last question but for some reasons it is not taken into account when people answer to it.

EDIT : Forget it, I've found it again on my stats.

[Osymandus]

Lol well do remember all human beings are on the autistic spectrum . Traits are more likely in people with one of the Dys (weather by virtue of teh condition of social conditioning ) as an example i tend to never feel guilty . I will rationalist the consequences but not alwasy have any reaction to the person i have performed an action against .

[dyspraxicgirl]

I know that most people show some autistic traits but I think that the link between all neurological conditions is very interesting, especially when it comes to dyspraxia because it is sometimes described just the way people describe Asperger Syndrome. I have not met many people who had a learning disability with more autistic traits than the others however, and I wish I could have put more questions in this survey.
The family history can be interesting too though most people have generally no diagnosis when they are old because it did not exist or was ignored when they were younger (my grandmothers are both dyslexic and have been diagnosed at 70-72).

I think that some autistic characteristics may be common among dyspraxic people because they tend to be face blind (which can lead to a misundertanding of body language I guess) or are unable to use properly body language.

However, routines, repetitive behaviours and narrow interests (or echolalia though I suspect that some people did not know what it was and did not do the research) cannot really be justified by dyspraxia. But since a Broader Autism Spectrum exist, I supppose that Dyspraxic people who are on the BAP have a tendency to look autistic enough to have a diagnosis or to be close to have one because of the characteristics of Dyspraxia.

From what I have read (the results), some characteristics are almost "universal", most dyspraxic people share them with autistic people even when they do not have Autism or when they do not show the other characteristics. Some ADHD characteristics are also common while other are not.

I also find it interesting to have a better definition of how most people are affected by dyspraxia, though I do not that Internet surveys are not always accurate, especially since I do not have a great sample of dyspraxic people right now, but I still think it can be useful, for example to help a young dyspraxic understand some of his behviours.

[Osymandus]

Us tehre are universal traits , and i would hold yo up on the focused intrest , as it is listed as being a sign of Dysprxia . Maybe its du to lack of multitasking ? who knows but those things that intrest us become our focus and ive been told off in teh past for talking about one subject way to much

I'd agree with the inability to read body language , i can read body movement very well but i do lack teh certan under lying "grammar" of body language at times.

Im also very happy when people like yourself to these surveys as it does help buidl up a body of evidence and refernce . Children do get teh lion share (and rightly so ) of resources for diagnosis , but as you state older peopel have been missed out and their lives can be improved by more awreness being raised in this way

More power to your elbow

[dyspraxicgirl]

Us tehre are universal traits , and i would hold yo up on the focused intrest , as it is listed as being a sign of Dysprxia . Maybe its du to lack of multitasking ? who knows but those things that intrest us become our focus and ive been told off in teh past for talking about one subject way to much

I'd agree with the inability to read body language , i can read body movement very well but i do lack teh certan under lying "grammar" of body language at times.

Im also very happy when people like yourself to these surveys as it does help buidl up a body of evidence and refernce . Children do get teh lion share (and rightly so ) of resources for diagnosis , but as you state older peopel have been missed out and their lives can be improved by more awreness being raised in this way

More power to your elbow

I am starting to think that routines ans repetitive behaviours among dyspraxic people could be normal even though not all of us are like that. I mean, planning and controling your life is a great way to overcome some of your difficulties. (This is a general "you")

As for the interests, I really have no idea. Being bad at multitasking does not necessarily mean that one will have narrow interests (to the point of being absorbed by them or being told that they are very narrow-minded and "in their own world") since one could have many interests but would not be able to devote time to more than one of them at a time (and I actually know that many "normal" people cannot do that either, depending on one's interests).

Anyway, from what I've read, most dyspraxic people tend to score higher than average on the Autism Quotient Test, which does not mean that Dyspraxia is on the Autism Spectrum (since results between 25 and 35 would mean Broader Autism Phenotype to mild Asperger) but show that the difficulties are not limited to motor skills (apart perhaps on the milder forms).

I find it even more interesting since there is a child in one of my classes who show dyspraxic characteristics with social difficulties (but great intelligence). I would not be surprised if he were to be diagnosed with dyspraxia since I had the same difficulties as a child but I know that some (including my flatmate) would argue that he is probably autistic.

[Osymandus]

It is a very intresting corrolation between what is a norm social behaviour and higher then average intelligence. Maybe its is the social norms that are at fault rather then the autistic people .

YEs a lack of multitasking would not preclude multiple interest's but your more likley to focus on those your are interested on more then as if your were NT so as to get more enjoyment out of that said interest .

Dyspraxia is an underdevelopment of teh Thalamus so sensor input is either reduced or exaggerated , so who's to say that dosnt type us closer to what is commonly refer to as an insular autistic state ? (btw i tested 27 on a Austic test ))

[Jen]

Hi all,

Not been on for a while, found this survey interesting. Though I had dyspraxia, ES confirmed some traits,was diagnosed with ADHD August 09 and have just been diagnosed with high functioning Autism both at The Maudley Hospital. Interestley they still think I have dyspraxia and I referring me for an OT assessment. Never mind at least I'm diverse

[Catwoman42]

I have echolalia! I didn't know they were related.

[dyspraxicgirl]

Echolalia is generally related to Autism (but it has also been associated with Schizophrenia and Tourette Syndrome for example), like narrow interests and repetitive behaviours.

Many dyspraxic people (in this test) have the same profile as Asperger people, however, echolalia does not seem to be one of them most of the time (I suspect many people to have voted "middle" because they did not know about echolalia or have never thought about it).

Most of the time, the dyspraxics with autistic traits are female (though actually, for now 74,2% of voters are female) and many specialists have agreed that female may be underdiagnosed when it comes to Autism or other disorders because their behaviour is different or more acceptable in the society (it would be quite interesting to link that with the "weaker sex" myth).

[raisin girl]

I think the reason for the link between autism and LDs is the sense of social "otherness" common to both and the difficulty with social cues, which is also common to both. However, what a lot of places don't mention is the subtle difference between the two in terms of how these difficulties translate. I read somewhere that the difference between ASD and dyspraxia is that a dyspraxic person understands certain behavioural rules (e.g the rules around space and body positioning) on an emotional level but their actual behaviour in practice doesn't always reflect that understanding, because of their poor space/body awareness and motor control and difficulty multi-tasking. A person on the autistic spectrum, on the other hand, lacks the intuitive understanding of why certain behaviour is seen as necessary in the first place and needs to have it explained to them. If you like, dyspraxics have difficulty with the "what" of doing things, autistics have difficulty with the "why" of doing things. It's just one opinion of many, (I wish I could remember the exact source) but from my own observations, it makes sense. For what it's worth, I'm dyspraxic/dyscalculic and scored within the control range on the AQ test - lower than many of my non-LD peers, let alone LD people - but I can sometimes relate to autistic traits as described elsewhere.

[Maau]

I don't have autism, but I am dyslexic, have processing problems with new information and borderline personality disorder. (not medicated at the moment, refuse to take the pills)

I was always above average intelligence until I turned 17 (I have 11 GCSE's, 10 were A-C one D), I was misdiagnosed with depression and put on all kinds of pills which I think did something as I lost a lot of my ability educationally. I dropped out of a levels, and one college course. I also notice I could do things before that I can't do now, it takes me ages to process anything I can't understand things I used to and my memory has gone to pot.

I would say we are similar to autistic people because we lack certain social cues, and we don't know how to react to certain things. But we are different because we can adapt, and still make really good friends. We just take longer to do so.